I worked with tohatsu on the height of the mount. no difference. I measured it and it ended up only being about 1 and 1/4 inch lower than stock.
Got back with tohatsu yesterday and they are stumped. They think the boat is two big for the engine and that is why the rpms are running 1200 rpm under nominal . Nominal being according to them 5500 rpm. They are sending me free of charge a 6 pitch prop to test and see what that does. They agree that I am not getting 6hp at the prop if im not getting 5500 rpm but I can tell they want to say it is because the boat is to big/heavy.
I have a new theory. The engine cranks and runs fine if it is a given that it is supposed to vibrate like it does. It produces just a little less power at the prop than the old engine. everyone I have talked to including tohatsu says that 4 strokes run just a slight bit weaker than a comparable 2 stroke. What if this engine just ended up accidentally having the jets for a 4hp version instead of 6 hp version installed. there is no physical difference in the 4hp/5hp/6hp engines other than how the carb is jetted. It would be consistent with everything that has been said and observed.
Anyway that is where it stands right now. I was going to return the engine this week but tohatsu offering to send the prop got me to agree to test that and see what the results are.
So far
- I am happy with the customer service from tohatsu USA and Vic who I have delt with there.
- I am unhappy with outboardsales.com as they have not responded to my last request for help at all.
- Based on Jons (from http://www.beneteau235.com forums) experience i think this engine is a great price/weight/power option for our boats.
- The fuel economy on this engine is awesome. I am getting 6+ hours of runtime on 2.5 gallons of fuel at WOT.
- I think my experience with this engine is probably atypical and that there is an issue with this specific engine.
- Either it is jetted wrong
- or something is wrong with the electronic ignition advance at the top end.
Jon on the beneteau235.com forums speaks up for outboardsales.com being friendly and helpful with his purchases. Actually here is a quote “I had great friendly service from them, both with the purchase of the outboard & the prop.” (I thought I would add this in just to be fair.)
I posted this back
“They were not friendly or unfriendly when I called them with the problem. I got them the information they asked for and then they dropped off the face of the earth. I have not badgered them so It is possible that in general they are not like this but just dropped the ball on this one. I have been working directly with tohatsu USA because I got a better vibe and response from them. If I return the engine it will be to outboardsales.com and I guess I will find out if it was a fluke or what by how they respond. ”
“I would recommend buying from http://internetoutboards.com if you purchase online. They are within a few dollars price wise and miles better with support/attitude. I had a list of several online merchants I had priced when looking for this engine and when I started to have problems I called their number by accident. we quickly sorted out that I hadn’t purchased from them but the service guy there was really friendly and spent some time giving me advice even after we found out they had not sold the engine to me. I mentioned to Vic at tohatsu how helpful they were to me even though they hadn’t sold me the engine and he said they were a good company and that he had worked with them before on stuff.”
Thats good information to know. I’m not using mine anymore as we have moved up to a bigger boat, but I still have the engine on my 23.5 ft boat and plan on using it a few years from now.
Have 9.8 it was laid in back of truck on wrong side for a couple of hrs. has pently of oil but can’t get spark from plugs.Motor ran fine b4 placing it in back of truck.Any advise would be helpful.Thanks
Yep that happens. you have gotten oil in the cylinder and possibly the carb. You will need to set it upright for a while so all the oil drains back into the pan and remove and clean the spark plug. Try starting it. If it is still hard to start give it a shot of ether/starter in the carb and try. If it still doesn’t start try cleaning the carb with carb cleaner in case some oil is in the jets etc… Should start back up. If not You might need to take carb apart or take to dealer. I would bet it is just fouled plugs.. oil on them.
Scott
I have a new Tohatsu 25 HP 3 cylinder fuel injected outboard on a 17 foot pontoon. After the engine has been running at 1/2 throttle for an hour or so it just quits? It always starts right back up with the electric start. I added some Sea Foam to the fuel. It never quits at a fast idle speed. Could my Fuel Demand Valve or pressurized fuel cap be defective?
I’m afraid I don’t know. That is something I have never had an issue with. You are probably going to need to take it to a mechanic or service center if you can’t find someone on the net that has had the same issue and posted a fix. Wish I could have helped more.
I have a 25hp Tohatsu EFI too. I noticed that running at slow speed such as trolling while fishing for extended periods , the motor would just stop but readily starts up too. It was suggested to me that I should check the level of oil in the engine–if it is above the full mark this can cause the engine to run too rich and “bog” out at low rpms
I have a 2001 Tohatsu 15hp 2 stroke. The engine runs fine if you will apply almost full choke, butterfly barely open. If the butterfly is fully open then engine bogs down when given throttle. I don’t see a way to tune the carb other than the one brass screw on the top of carb. Do you hand tighten this screw down while at idle, in the water, then back it of a certain number of turns?
keith,
I don’t have an answer for you.. I would give your local service center a call and ask them or give Tohatsu USA a call. I’m pretty sure they could give you a good answer in a couple minutes.
That all being said here is my best guess which isn’t that great.. it sounds like an adjustment issue or potential cleaning issue in the carb.. maybe run a can of seafoam through it and see if it clears up.
I have a 2011 20 HP Tohatsu with electric start. The motor will only start with the choke all the way out. It will only idle that way and will only accelerate with the choke all the way out. If I push the choke in it dies right away. What could this be????
Guy
I would talk to a service center. I know a bit about the smaller engines but don’t know what would be causing what your speaking about other than to say it sounds like a carberator issue.
I have a 2007 tohatsu 25 hp. The engine starts good and runs great. After about 20 min or so the engine dies. The engine is extremely hot. The pull cord will not pull at all. The motor seems to be locked up.After the motor completely cools the motor starts right up. The water pump is new and there is a good steady stream coming from the motor.Any ideas. Someone told me it could be a bearing going out. Any ideas?
I don’t have any practical experience with those symptoms but just off the top of my head based on the basic physics I would say the engine or something in it is getting to hot and seizing up. I would get it looked at before trying to run it any more. That kind of heat seizing will kill it. Your lucky it hasn’t permanently done so already. Are you sure it has enough oil in it? that is the only thing I can think of if you are getting full water flow through it. Also I don’t know how many passages there are through the block for that water flow but maybe one of them is blocked and your still getting flow through the rest? that is just a guess of something to ask about a dealer or knowledgeable mechanic. Very first thing I would look at is oil though.
I have a 2011 25 hp four stroke that just went out of warranty and found out that one of the cylinder pressure relief valves broke off of the crank shaft. The USA Tohatsu center told me the engine would run fine without it but when cranked it make take two or so attempts as it will not allow the cylinder that lost the relief valve to turn over. Now I have to replace the crank shaft and pay the labor/parts costs for the repair. Oh, the company did give me a 10% parts discount, but that is still going to be a hefty bill.
I have a 1999 40hp and it is only pushing my 16′ boat 20mph. Has very little power on take off. Potential issues causing this? I am a novice at this.
Sounds like something in the carburetor. I would run a can of seafoam through it. Seafoam is a gas additive that cleans the carb and other parts of the engine. If after following the directions on the can of seafoam it is still doing it, then I would take it to a service center. You can purchase seafoam at walmart or any auto parts store. Seafoam has been my go to miracle cure for carb issues.
I have a 50 tohatsu 2 stroke on a 16 foot Jon boat at full throttle the motor sends out an alarm that makes me return to idle wait a few seconds then is good to go again. Can run 3/4 throttle all day long some say could be rev limter
Strange, I would also think it was in the rev limiter. I would call a service center or tohatsu USA and ask them about it. I have never seen that before.
Hi guys I just bought a fairly new looking tohatsu 30hp outboard very good condition but it won’t go into forward gear when I put into forward gear the prop still turns relatively free but you can hear it trying to grab inside but just keeps skipping over I pulled apart everything is perfect inside no wear on anything any ideas.
that sounds like a linkage issue to me but that is an area I am not an expert on. You should check and see if there is a way to adjust the linkage so that it goes fully into gear. Other than that I would take it in to a service center.
I have a 2004 25C3. It won’t run at high speed. runs good in idle but when I give it gas it will sputter and die. I cleaned carb to no avail.
Maybe still an issue with carb or the choke. Could also be ignition advance I suppose. I’m not familar with that specific engine so you might want to talk to tohatsu or a local service center.
hey scott i have a 1995 90hp tohatsu and it runs fine for about 5-10 mins then no matter how much throttle you give it its idle speed. any ideas on how to fix it? thanks frank
hmm… sounds like something happening as engine heats up. No clue as to what it could be though. You getting good water flow and engine staying at normal temp? Maybe an automatic choke that isn’t working correctly?
Just not that familiar with the bigger engines. I would give tohatsu a call and ask them what they think.
I have a 1996 tohatsui 50hp that does not go into reverse I was told the housing was worn keeping it from going into reverse
Not familiar with the bigger engines like that. Not sure what the engine housing would have to do with the shifter though.
Ok I have a 2006 Tohatsu 40 horsepower it runs great cold but once it gets warm it wants to cut out and die it acts like it is almost flooding it is a 2 stroke and it is also fuel injected after it gets warm it does not want to run wide open throttle its like it has no power and it is very hard to get it to start back up I’ve spent thousands of dollars trying to get it running again if there is anything you can do to help me it would be much appreciated
I’m sorry but other than thinking it might be a fuel air issue I don’t have any experience with that engine. Only other thing I can think is maybe an issue with a automatic timing advance issue that starts when the ignition module gets hot. not sure if that engine has an electronic ignition or not but something to think about. Or does it have an automatic choke? if so is it unchoking as it gets warm. That sounds like a symptom of a choke on full on a warm engine.
it all pretty much comes back to 3 main things.
Fuel
Air
and Spark.
Scott, I have a 2011 30 hp efi tohatsu, I have about 2000 hours on it. it idles fine and runs good to 1/4 throttle, on muffs it will pop thru the exhaust. in the water it looses 1/2 its power over 1/4 throttle. i got even compression on all three..any idea’s ? thanks, john
Has to be the carb or the ignition. Not something I have seen before so can’t give any particular stuff to test out of my head.
double check the choke is opening up..
ignition wise… bad spark plug? or timing issue with the ignition module? Not sure if it has a coil.. check that. these are just some of the random ideas I had thinking about it. I would call tohatsu or a service center and describe the issue and see what they say.If it isn’t the carb it should be pretty easy/cheap to fix.. replace coil/sparkplugs/ignition module etc… something of that nature.
I have a 2013 20 horse it cranks fine idles fine and will throttle up fine in neutral but when I put in gear and throttle up it cuts out and dies. It will restart fine but does the same again when put in gear.. never had a problem until this year.
We have an older tahatsu 40horse,outboard 2 stroke,probably mid90s,,,it won’t shift into fwd gear but will go in reverse,,any ideas? Did a little work on it,now it ,will shift with the lower unit off into fwd,,put lower unit back on same thing,,,any ideas or suggestions?
No, I have no experience with working on the transmissions at all. I would give tohatsu a call or find a local shop and ask their advice.
Our sailing club has 10 motors, most of them made by Tohatsu, and there are general guides on our website at http://www.cal-sailing.org/images/stories/files/motors.pdf and http://www.cal-sailing.org/images/stories/files/SkiffMotor.pdf . For people having trouble with idling and starting, see the notes about checking for bad gas/water-contaminated gas, crap-in-carb is #1 cause of motor problems. Anyone working on the motors, get the Mercury service manual first, get an air compressor with rubber-tipped blowgun to blow out the carb especially the jets, acetone works great for cleaning followed by wire brush and scraping with a pick and knife. Shifting problems, be very careful to properly adjust the clamp position on the shift rod, or it won’t go into and stay in gear. Spark problems clean up the grounding point first, use a new plug, check for spark with plug removed and grounded to engine case before installing, if no spark, try another plug, spark plugs aren’t made well, before throwing money at new CDI, coil, etc. Bigger engines with EFI get the diagnostic done, or buy the setup; sensors and solenoids often fail that you wouldn’t expect to cause the problem, and the diagnostic catches many problems in minutes. 25/30 EFI from 2014 can leak oil from defective oil sump casting, cylinder heads won’t drain completely and will corrode through heads. Good luck, and come visit when you’re in Berkeley.
Tohatsu 90 starter motor not engaging after charging battery starter motor would spin and not engage with fly wheel. Used to do every now again , Used to just give it a tap and a bit of WD40 and boom away she go but know just spins.can manually trunk it up to fly wheel then just drops back down ?????
After reading all of this I have a few general comments, not brand specific, that may help some people.
1. The Horse Power issue. Sometime in the 1970’s there was an issue with many smaller engines not reaching their claimed HP. There was a legal decision in the USA and companies were fined and forced to downgrade their HP ratings. As I understand it the companies claimed that their engines were rated at the motor and the legal decision was that they must be rated at the propeller. As a result motors such as the former 10HP Evinrude were then sold a 9.9HP, and the former 18HP Evinrudes were sold as 15HP. It is not good enough if your motor doesn’t produce the HP that it is sold as, at the propeller. I am no legal expert but the seller should have an obligation to make under performing motors produce the stated HP or refund you the money.
2. Sometime in the 1970’s, I think it was Yamaha brought out two stroke small outboards that ran on 100:1 fuel. With no engine changes at all, Evinrude and others decided that their engines, previously 50:1, would now run on 100:1 but with the added proviso that it was recommended that 50:1 be used for “commercial use”. I have a 1986 15HP Evinrude that still has the 100:1 label on it. Some years after this change to 100:1, Evenrude decided that it had not been a good idea to change to 100:1 and changed their recommendations back to 50:1. Not everybody got the message though, and I have been running my motor for around 30 years with insufficient oil. For all that, it has been a good motor with minimal servicing and maintenance. It is used on a 12ft alloy boat, used for duck shooting and some net fishing but gets only about 5 hours use a year.
3. I have seen motors cutting out or bottoming out before maximum speed because of restrictions in the fuel supply. Once it was a small piece of rubber in the float bowl that wasn’t a problem at half throttle with a low fuel demand, but when the throttle was opened wide it would restrict the fuel leaving the bowl. The rubber had presumably come from the hose to the tank.
4. Be careful who you get to “service” you carburetor. I went to one authorised agent who simply replaced the plugs with a hotter version and sprayed some instant carburetor cleaner into the air intake while the engine was running and charged me $300. It is supposed to be very bad to clean two stroke carburetors with such cleaners as they enter the combustion chamber and create a serious lack of lubrication whilst they are there. The only way to clean a carburetor properly is to strip it down and remove the jets and soak everything in solvent. Blow out the jets with air and/or spray can cleaner, and re-soak/repeat if necessary. Do not wire brush as suggested by a previous commenter. Do not poke the jets with wire to clean them. The hotter plugs didn’t work for me at all. Slow speed running quickly oiled them up and they needed to be changed for the standard ones.
5. Fuel Issues – In NZ there are only two fuels readily available at the pump, 91 and 96 octane, with or without methanol. Outboard manufacturers generally recommend 91 octane and that say “old fuel”, greater than 3 months old, shouldn’t be used. The trouble is that most cars here now use 96 octane and as a result when you buy 91 octane fuel from the pump it is already old, possibly more than 3 months old. Much more chance of it being contaminated with moisture and much more chance of being full of the contaminants/varnishes that develop in so called “old fuel”. The 96 octane because of its higher use rate is therefore much fresher. I had a friend that seized his 15HP Evinrude on a 15 minute run on one year old fuel. Engine started easily, ran well and then abruptly seized.
6. Fuel Issues – Methanol – Everyone seems to think that methanol in fuel is bad, and I have pondered this. If you buy proprietary Fuel Stabiliser to add to your fuel to stop it going off and producing the varnishes that gum up your carburetor, you will find that most of it contains large amounts of Isopropyl Alcohol. Now Isopropyl Alcohol (IPA) and Methyl Alcohol (Methanol), aren’t too far apart as alcohols go. True there will be some things that IPA will dissolve and Methanol will not a vice versa but I would suspect that both would do a very good job of stopping fuel from going “off” and preventing the gum from forming. Although I don’t use Methanol fuels, I suspect that it may be even better for OBM use and storage. Methanol fuels that I have come across are never 100% Methanol and are just standard fuel with a percentage of Methanol added. Methanol got its bad name because in earlier days it attacked some of the plastics in fuel hoses, carburetors and pumps etc but modern cars have long had that sorted and I assume most OBMs are the same.
7. The person who couldn’t use Seafoam in his tank because it held 150 gallons needs to get a small portable tank to use as a “snap tank”. Just take say a 5 gallon tank, fill with fuel and oil and add the additive and run until empty and repeat if necessary. This is also a good way of determining how many hours per gallon you are getting from your OBM. Add a measured amount of fuel to your snap tank, say 1 pint,start the stopwatch and run the boat until it stops, then do the math. Ideally such a tank for determining hours per gallon must be capable of using 100% of the fuel added.
After reading all of this I have a few general comments, not brand specific, that may help some people.
1. The Horse Power issue. Sometime in the 1970’s there was an issue with many smaller engines not reaching their claimed HP. There was a legal decision in the USA and companies were fined and forced to downgrade their HP ratings. As I understand it the companies claimed that their engines were rated at the motor and the legal decision was that they must be rated at the propeller. As a result motors such as the former 10HP Evinrude were then sold a 9.9HP, and the former 18HP Evinrudes were sold as 15HP. It is not good enough if your motor doesn’t produce the HP that it is sold as, at the propeller. I am no legal expert but the seller should have an obligation to make under performing motors produce the stated HP or refund you the money.
2. Sometime in the 1970’s, I think it was Yamaha brought out two stroke small outboards that ran on 100:1 fuel. With no engine changes at all, Evinrude and others decided that their engines, previously 50:1, would now run on 100:1 but with the added proviso that it was recommended that 50:1 be used for “commercial use”. I have a 1986 15HP Evinrude that still has the 100:1 label on it. Some years after this change to 100:1, Evenrude decided that it had not been a good idea to change to 100:1 and changed their recommendations back to 50:1. Not everybody got the message though, and I have been running my motor for around 30 years with insufficient oil. For all that, it has been a good motor with minimal servicing and maintenance. It is used on a 12ft alloy boat, used for duck shooting and some net fishing but gets only about 5 hours use a year.
3. I have seen motors cutting out or bottoming out before maximum speed because of restrictions in the fuel supply. Once it was a small piece of rubber in the float bowl that wasn’t a problem at half throttle with a low fuel demand, but when the throttle was opened wide it would restrict the fuel leaving the bowl. The rubber had presumably come from the hose to the tank.
4. Be careful who you get to “service” you carburetor. I went to one authorised agent who simply replaced the plugs with a hotter version and sprayed some instant carburetor cleaner into the air intake while the engine was running and charged me $300. It is supposed to be very bad to clean two stroke carburetors with such cleaners as they enter the combustion chamber and create a serious lack of lubrication whilst they are there. The only way to clean a carburetor properly is to strip it down and remove the jets and soak everything in solvent. Blow out the jets with air and/or spray can cleaner, and re-soak/repeat if necessary. Do not wire brush as suggested by a previous commenter. Do not poke the jets with wire to clean them. The hotter plugs didn’t work for me at all. Slow speed running quickly oiled them up and they needed to be changed for the standard ones.
5. Fuel Issues – In NZ there are only two fuels readily available at the pump, 91 and 96 octane, with or without methanol. Outboard manufacturers generally recommend 91 octane and that say “old fuel”, greater than 3 months old, shouldn’t be used. The trouble is that most cars here now use 96 octane and as a result when you buy 91 octane fuel from the pump it is already old, possibly more than 3 months old. Much more chance of it being contaminated with moisture and much more chance of being full of the contaminants/varnishes that develop in so called “old fuel”. The 96 octane because of its higher use rate is therefore much fresher. I had a friend that seized his 15HP Evinrude on a 15 minute run on one year old fuel. Engine started easily, ran well and then abruptly seized.
6. Fuel Issues – Methanol – Everyone seems to think that methanol in fuel is bad, and I have pondered this. If you buy proprietary Fuel Stabiliser to add to your fuel to stop it going off and producing the varnishes that gum up your carburetor, you will find that most of it contains large amounts of Isopropyl Alcohol. Now Isopropyl Alcohol (IPA) and Methyl Alcohol (Methanol), aren’t too far apart as alcohols go. True there will be some things that IPA will dissolve and Methanol will not a vice versa but I would suspect that both would do a very good job of stopping fuel from going “off” and preventing the gum from forming. Although I don’t use Methanol fuels, I suspect that it may be even better for OBM use and storage. Methanol fuels that I have come across are never 100% Methanol and are just standard fuel with a percentage of Methanol added. Methanol got its bad name because in earlier days it attacked some of the plastics in fuel hoses, carburetors and pumps etc but modern cars have long had that sorted and I assume most OBMs are the same.
7. The person who couldn’t use Seafoam in his tank because it held 150 gallons needs to get a small portable tank to use as a “snap tank”. Just take say a 5 gallon tank, fill with fuel and oil and add the additive and run until empty and repeat if necessary. This is also a good way of determining how many hours per gallon you are getting from your OBM. Add a measured amount of fuel to your snap tank, say 1 pint,start the stopwatch and run the boat until it stops, then do the math. Ideally such a tank for determining hours per gallon must be capable of using 100% of the fuel added.
it sounds like the solenoid that shoots the gear forward to engage the flywheel needs to be repaired or replaced.
Really glad you commented as I had not heard some of this information on the laws here in the US before. I do know I felt badly used by tohatsu and even more so by the local service center. Tohatsu took his word that the engine was ok even though all he did was crank it up and verify it ran. He even told me that he didn’t even have a tachometer that he could put on the engine to test rpm, that they didn’t do that!!! I know that tohatsu has to be aware of the issue and won’t admit to it in any way shape or form. After we tested multiple engines and got the same results it was pretty obvious they were running as designed.
I have a 2 stroke 25 hp tohatsu outboard. The cranks planes off and runs at high speed great. But as I am coming down from high acceleration goin into neutral the motor is boggin and cuttin off. It will fire back up and off you go again until you try to stop again. What could be the issue?
hi ive just replaced water impeller pump on a 2001 4hp tohatsu water pumps fine starts great wont go into reverse or neutral, stuck in forward any ideas
I have a 3.5 tohatsu M35A 40215, that runs great but seems to slip at high speed, disassembled and couldn’t find the problem. any ideas?
No, im not familiar with the gearing on it. As far as I am aware it is a straight on off gearing. No differential or transmission of any kind. only two possibilities that I can think of are that the gears are stripped/stripping (i would think that you would get horrible grinding noises if so) the shaft into engine is slipping.. horrible noises again 🙂 or prop is slipping on drive shaft… it’s been a while but I think there is a soft key that can shear if you hit something to try and save the engine from destruction. Maybe that has sheared?
My 9.8 two stroke has throttle problems . After she starts she goes to about half / three quarter throttle and she won’t throttle down .
first thing I would look at is the throttle spring and all the moving linkages from throttle handle to engine.
I have a 4stroke pro sail, lately it seems to run out of fuel at idle, and flood itself enough to come out of the overflow pipe when running mid revs. have cleaned the carby 3 times now.. still happens intermittently now.. where do I start looking??
I have never seen that but would think a carb rebuild or replacement.
Scott, neither did my Tohatsu dealer mechanics, the first time I had it serviced because it started happening more frequent, he stated that it was imposible. After his (3 times) attempts to fix it, each time cleaning the carburettor, stating it runs perfect in the test tank, I changed to a new Tohasu dealer (mechanic)..This now will be his 3rd attempt at solving the apparent carburettor problem..he left me a message saying he thinks he found the problem..he thinks he found a fuel pump irregularity..will get back to you if he solves the problem..Alfie
G’day Scott, well the problem solved, mechanic rebuild carby, problem still there. ..readjusted float level, problem still there..installed new fuelpump, problem still there.. Only thing left not touched was needle seat.. can’t get to..replace with a whole new carby.. problem sorted…So what ever the problem with the topend of the carby???either a loose needlevalve seat or a crack in the housing allowing fuel to bypass the needle valve…But I now have reliable motor driving my boat again…So happy boating from hereon…Alfie
Dang!! thats a rough one. I hate it when issues are really weird stuff like that, that doesn’t respond to normal troubleshooting. Glad you finally got it fixed. Hope it didn’t cost a significant price of a new engine getting it worked on all those times. I would be tempted to submit bills and carb to tohatsu saying it was a defective carb issue. Thats not something that should normally happen I don’t think. Not that they will reimburse you but it might give you some joy blowing smoke up their … well you know. 🙂
I have a m120a I have just set motor back to standard settings accordingly to manual. I cannot achieve full throttle, please help! I have adjusted cables too and fro but have not achieve much by doing so,